How to be the best MBA Associate possible? Advice needed for your average Joe.
How should I approach my first year as an mba associate? A little background: I’m a post-MBA associate about to start full-time at a bb. I didn’t receive a summer internship during my mba stint and had to network my ass off for a full-time position, so I will be going in with no ib experience. This makes me a little nervous as I feel like I have to prove myself more than the folks who converted their summer internships. I have never been the smartest guy in the room - hell, I even think some of the new undergrad analysts will have higher intellectual horsepower than me - and it takes time, dedication, and repetition for me to learn and become good at things. In contrast, for others, it may come naturally to them. I am not fooling myself by thinking I will be top bucket, nor do I want to burn myself out in pursuit of that as I want to stay in banking long term. All I want is to be a value-added team member that others can rely on and who will eventually have enough experience and knowledge to become a senior banker. I know that mba associates are looked down on, and I want to earn the respect of all my peers. Should I approach my first 6 months to a year as an “analyst” with a supervisory role, ie. do half of everything they do, bust my ass over longer than normal hours while still managing analysts for the first 6 months so I can become as proficient as possible? What is the balance here? I would appreciate to hear from all levels of banking.
I also have a young family, so I want to manage my work/life balance as best as possible. I understand this will be difficult and I may need to sacrifice the first few years while on the desk (especially the first year) so that I can become the best banker possible, which in turn will allow me to give my family the best life possible. For those with young families, how did you manage this?
ex analyst to MF PE here. I would say first to kill any ego you have, and then try to work with good analysts. Do the work they don’t want to do, and then ask them to walk you through their model / whatever work they did. This can function as a “review” but it is more about getting up to speed on what they did. And as they walk you through it, they might find a couple mistakes anyway. Also – sidebar here but if you have time, try to rebuild small model sections; I did this as a 1st year analyst and it helped me ramp immensely. Anyway – ask your analyst lots of questions, and make sure they understand you aren’t trying to play gotcha or assert yourself, but you are just trying to learn. The hard truth is any decent second year analyst will run circles around you for your first year, so just try to be kind and create a win-win environment.
Thanks for the response and great advice. A couple questions for you: I am not dumb, but I know my limits, and I ask a lot of questions. So, how would you suggest I learn from analysts without having them lose respect for me? Would this be by being earnest in my intentions to learn? Ultimately, I understand the importance of keeping the associate-analyst hierarchy intact. Where is the balance here? Also, to what extent should I go to an analyst vs an associate for help/learning?
I think everything is in framing. Say your analyst does some solid work that you want to review, I would ask them if you can “go through it together to make make sure we are aligned and I understand what you did” or something like this. Not “hey please teach me.” Then ask them why did you do x, how did you get assumption y, etc. Then go back to your desk and rebuild any confusing parts. In this way, the analyst is teaching you, in effect, but you aren’t being servile. Again, a good analyst will run circles around you – even a rising 2nd year is going to have 4,000 hours of experience plus several years of anticipation / internship recruiting / internships, so it is just going to be that way and you need to accept that.
In my view, yes hierarchy is important longer term, but these analysts are going to be gone in a year or max two, so as a first year associate, I would suggest you generally ignore the hierarchy when it comes to specific workstreams. As you get to year 2+, I think you can start to assert yourself a lot more. Maybe on early staffings with me they were effectively junior to me, but I’m sure 9 months later when they were working with a first year analyst, that script had started to flip.
In terms of who to learn from, I would say your deal team, and then outside of that have discussions with other associates. But most important would be try to make it a win-win for whoever your teacher / learning partner is. And socially, go get lunch with other Associates or VPs to associate yourself with them.
Apologies for the rambling but hope this helps
You say you have a family, kids, etc.,
Presumably you've had a successful career so far. Why are you so worried about what some 22 year old fresh out of college thinks of you?
Some of this post is almost cartoonish, to the point where it almost seems like a troll but I'll bite:
Solid advice, agree with all of the above. For context… I joined in 2021 as an MBA associate. I’m the only one left in my class, everyone else left or got fired.
Interesting. Just curious, what do you think has set you apart from your mba peers that you are still in the industry and they are not? Family issues, burnout, better wlb?
Not a troll post haha. Good advice though and helps me put some things into perspective. I appreciate it. I’m not worrying excessively about those things, but those dynamics have crossed my mind, so I asked.
There should be some amount of wanting the analysts that work with you to like/respect you, especially if you’re considering a career in IB. Guess who goes to PE and (if they stick around after asso years) may eventually decide which bank gets the fee for selling their portco? Good chance it’s the analysts you work with now. The take above is pretty shortsighted imo
Started as an MBA Associate last summer and I also have two young kids so I'll my perspective:
- First 12 months are crucial, market is tough right now, my bank laid off 1st year analysts and stub associates so definitely recommend busting your ass the first 12 months to establish your reputation and learn a ton
- Every second year analyst knows they're better at this job than you, it's not a matter of arrogance but as another poster mentioned they have 4000+ hours of experience in the role
- To the above point don't worry about losing face by asking them a ton of questions, there is very little about this job that you're going to know more than the experienced analysts do, they know that, they expect it, the first 6-12 months you can ask almost anything, they're going to respect you if they see you in the office working hard with them, not because of how much you think you know about modelling
- Schedule "review" sessions with your analyst, 60 minute sessions are a great way to go through the model, ask question about assumptions, mechanics, data sources, etc, this is a lot more efficient way to review and understand the model than the analyst just sending it to you and you "reviewing"
- You can become valuable quicker by understanding the intricacies of a process, thinking ahead to next steps, taking items off your VP's plate, and being super responsive to your bosses and client
- As you mentioned don't worry about being top bucket, you have a family, you need to work hard but not to the extent that you isolate your family, try to find pockets of time you can dedicate to them, this will vary depending on the bank but Friday dinners, Sunday brunches, Saturday afternoon at the park, try to find somewhere in the week where your family can count on spending time with you
- Manage expectations with your wife, it's going to be just as intense on her as she deals with the kid(s) everyday without your help, don't say you'll be home by "x" time because that invariably gets messed up, as you build a reputation you'll start to get more control over your schedule but if you're always the guy leaving at 6 or 7 because you're feeling the pressure from your wife then that's a quick way to lose the respect and dedication of your analyst
End of the day my first year has sucked, it's a brutal industry that is unforgiving for those people with families. You're going to catch shit from your bosses at work because you'll certainly mess things up as an MBA Associate and then go home and catch shit from your wife because she's tired. All that said, you've got to have strong conviction that this is a career you want to pursue and that the long term benefits are worth the grind.
Good luck in the new role and wishing you all the best.
Dude, this stuff is gold in my book. Thanks.
1) Make bedtime when you can, but promising you'll make it is a recipe for disappointment.
2) Running stroller / bike trailer kills 3 birds with 1 stone: give your spouse a break, spend time with kid, get exercise... you can usually find 30 minutes a couple days a week.
Hey can I pm you? You sound like an interesting persona and this post is inspiring for those trying to break in (laid off analyst).
Just do all the work for your analysts so they can recruit for buyside, dude
Ask for the powerpoint and make direct edits instead of blasting comments to senior analysts (good second years, 3rd years)
Go in with the attitude that you're temporarily the bottom guy on the totem pole, below even the analysts. Don't try to manage them when you don't know shit. Do the modeling yourself, or if you have an analyst on a project then make sure you understand every cell of the model; TBH the best way to do that is probably to still build your own, but you can avoid that if you're disciplined about truly understanding every cell.
Do this and in a few months you'll actually be qualified to manage them. Instead of the associate who tries to manage from Day 1 and never really learns things on the ground floor.
Congratulations on your offer, OP! This is really exciting. I like your approach to your new job and with your curiosity, you will do great!
Would be curious to learn how you went about your networking. Please let me know if you’re open to a coffee chat. Thank you!
Above all else, make sure to approach the job from a sustainable POV. Dont even try for top bucket your first 18 months - you likely wont get it anyway. Do your job well, be responsive, but live to fight another day as a Senior Associate / VP when you start to actually make decent coin.
No sense in burning yourself out early on, with what the market is right now no one is getting rich as an associate.
If the above means delegating to your 22 y/o analyst so you can catch up on sleep, do it.
Read Discussion Materials by Bill Keenan
Sed inventore dicta voluptas reprehenderit. Voluptatem voluptatem est cumque quia consectetur vitae quos voluptatum. Esse officia dignissimos mollitia nihil necessitatibus eos quos.
Eos unde consequatur eum et omnis ea architecto. Qui eos asperiores nihil deleniti dolor commodi ut. Sunt quia labore error distinctio fuga veritatis aut. Itaque voluptates ea corporis ut. Amet harum sed ex ex qui. Quae et architecto autem. Reprehenderit recusandae qui suscipit sed molestiae rerum error.
Aut molestias tempore corporis sit. Distinctio dicta aut voluptates reprehenderit. Est neque fugit quod doloremque id sapiente. Eos quisquam quibusdam accusantium veritatis nemo. Est velit possimus et veritatis enim facere.
Suscipit ratione cupiditate ut voluptatibus et provident aliquam. Magnam laudantium veniam architecto corporis maxime. Et mollitia aspernatur qui error in aliquid tempore sed.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...